Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby axelnied » Tue May 26, 2015 6:49 pm

I really cannot blame the motors...! They ran fine when just connecting them to the receiver throttle output. After reading this forum for several years I strongly believe the frame caused the issue. AQ likes rigid/stiff frames! I ditched the soft 3d printed frame for something much stiffer. 3mm carbon arms, and overall better quality. no rubber mounts etc.

There are the motors I used before:
http://shop.hovership.com/h2204x-1960kv-brushless-motor/
These are the motors I use now (untested in flight)
http://www.buildrcdrones.com/store/p86/RCMC_2208_1900KV.html

I am using 4S with 6 inch props.
axelnied
 
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby brat002 » Tue May 26, 2015 9:50 pm

I think, this kind of problems with fried motors is not motors or bearings. Other controllers flies well with h2204 and with fpvmodel mc2212. Very high D parameter can fry motors and it looks, like my and your motors was fried because default pids are not for all motors.

Now my motors has "fried" bearings and wiring... So sad. I not know what will do next with my M4. I don`t want fry my 4 x T-motor mn4006, that I planned to use with Autoquad.
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby axelnied » Tue May 26, 2015 10:24 pm

MN4006? that's larger size motors on a different frame I suppose? u could post some details here and ask for feedback... I successfully tested mn3110 hexagon with standard PIDs. it is only the small crafts that have some tuning resilience.
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby aBUGSworstnightmare » Wed May 27, 2015 7:37 am

axelnied wrote:MN4006? that's larger size motors on a different frame I suppose? u could post some details here and ask for feedback... I successfully tested mn3110 hexagon with standard PIDs. it is only the small crafts that have some tuning resilience.


Brat is talking about his TBS Disco frame. Refer to viewtopic.php?f=36&t=4481 and viewtopic.php?f=40&t=4472

EDIT:
brat002 wrote:I have these problems too. Already fried two motors for last 2 weeks of tunning PID parameters. Looks, like M4 is totally unflyable solution without quatos...

Here are some crafts with M4:
250size - M4BLDC expansion board, KISS ESCs


rOsewhite Saphire (viewtopic.php?f=40&t=4313)
Tiger MN1806 2300KV, 6045 HQProps, KISS 12A ESCs, M4BLDC expansion board

PIDs for this flight
Code: Select all
CTRL_FACT_PITC             0.0900000035763
CTRL_FACT_ROLL             0.0900000035763
CTRL_FACT_THRO               0.40000000596
CTRL_MAN_YAW_RT                         240

CTRL_TLT_ANG_D                        3000
CTRL_TLT_ANG_DM                         900
CTRL_TLT_ANG_I            0.00499999988824
CTRL_TLT_ANG_P                         280
CTRL_TLT_ANG_PM                        1200

CTRL_TLT_RTE_D                        6000
CTRL_TLT_RTE_OM                        3000

MOT_FRAME           1.24340309609e-38
MOT_PWRD_05_P                         100
MOT_PWRD_05_R                         100
MOT_PWRD_05_T                         100
MOT_PWRD_05_Y                        -100
MOT_PWRD_06_P                         100
MOT_PWRD_06_R                        -100
MOT_PWRD_06_T                         100
MOT_PWRD_06_Y                         100
MOT_PWRD_07_P                        -100
MOT_PWRD_07_R                        -100
MOT_PWRD_07_T                         100
MOT_PWRD_07_Y                        -100
MOT_PWRD_08_P                        -100
MOT_PWRD_08_R                         100
MOT_PWRD_08_T                         100
MOT_PWRD_08_Y                         100

NAV_MAX_SPEED                          15
RADIO_SETUP                           7
SPVR_VIN_SOURCE                           1

and one 300size, MN2206-13, KISS 12A, M4BLDC, 2S

All these frames have some similarities: they are STIFF, M4 is mounted HARD

Are the standoffs in your Disco going connecting the TOP with BOTTOM plate next to the FC? You should be able to add 2 more standoffs there to increase stiffness.
AND: NONE OF THES CRAFTS USES QUATOS!
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby axelnied » Wed May 27, 2015 4:18 pm

I used to own a TBS Disco Pro with Carbon arms from Aerial Mob. Pretty nice design, but wobbly (soft) as hell. But the biggest advantage of these frames is also its biggest weakness: Electronics are integrated into the top and bottom plates. One crash and you are toast... In my opinion then top and bottom plates are way too thin, the standard arms are soft (probably by design), and the mounting methodology (inserts in the arms) is not promoting stiffness. Through-bolts with washer and lock-nuts would be much better.

These TBS frames are quite popular (with DJI FC) so selling them for little to no loss should not be a problem.
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby brat002 » Wed May 27, 2015 8:14 pm

My friends are flying TBS Disco with Naza without any problem. And i flied TBS with naza and taulabs Quanton pretty good. Why autoquad so sensitive to frame geometry and stiffness? I don`t want to sell this frame, because Disco is very good and other controllers not have these problems. May be problem in software?
brat002
 
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby brat002 » Wed May 27, 2015 8:21 pm

I am waiting for new motors. Then i will try again.
Thanks all.
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby brat002 » Wed May 27, 2015 9:40 pm

@aBUGSworstnightmare
How do you calculate limits? It is not stock values and manual do not cover these calculations.
brat002
 
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby brat002 » Wed May 27, 2015 10:45 pm

I found, CTRL_MAX default value is ~1470. It is not too big? It may be source of problems with fried motors?
brat002
 
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Re: Default PIDs seem VERY high!?

Postby brat002 » Sat May 30, 2015 6:21 am

With new motors SunnySky v2216 650kv and default PIDs i have overheating again.
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