Acro mode! And more...

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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Patscherpofel » Fri Oct 28, 2016 10:21 am

and one thing I immediately noticed is that the different firmwares have very different performance on the quad
I recently changed to esc32v3 and tried them first on the new fw...it was shking badly on take off so I thought it was the faster esc and retuned it...tried a lot but only thing that helped was reducing both f values to around 0.18 ,but still it never flew super stable...(this is pid mode)
now back on the old fw I tried for fun to retune it again and pretty much ended up on my old values wich fly much better again

hmm so I have a bit of a dilemma going on

old 52 fw
+flies fantastic
+yaw contoles according to my stick input and not so erratic and robotic like on the new one
-it has this horrible stick delay on roll and pitch...which is an absolute nogo for me
this delay make it very mushy to control ...for example if you want to land it spot on, or also hand catch it
the new smoothing filter in the new fw was helping a lot (giving a sharper control when reduced) so I really thought I would be happy from now on

new fw
+has more direct stick input if you lower the tau filter
-never found a decent pid value for good flight performance
-has the described yaw problem in between the adjustable deadband (very noticable if you reduce it to almost 0)
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Max » Fri Oct 28, 2016 10:42 am

Hi Pat,

I'd like to look into these problems more. Just to be clear... which firmware are you calling the "old 52?" 7.1.1852? And also which is "new?" This "acro mode" one (7.1.1923)?

What about 7.1.1897 (the last "next" branch build)?

Thanks,
-Max
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Patscherpofel » Fri Oct 28, 2016 10:55 am

which firmware are you calling the "old 52?" 7.1.1852?

yes correct


And also which is "new?" This "acro mode" one (7.1.1923)?

yes correct

What about 7.1.1897 (the last "next" branch build)?

never tried it so far, should I?

thanks for the help!
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Max » Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:05 am

Patscherpofel wrote:so I tried the the new option to lower deadband of yaw in the Ground Control ...lowered it to only 2
and now something very strange happens...if I yaw very slow left it goes to slowley to the right!!!
if I go to the right it still does that jump and then goes to the right


OK, found this bug pretty quickly. The new yaw deadband setting isn't properly implemented... so it won't work when different from the pitch/roll deadband. Easy fix but silly mistake. :(

I'm not sure about the jump thing. Does it jump right or left?

Patscherpofel wrote:What about 7.1.1897 (the last "next" branch build)?

never tried it so far, should I?


Yes please, that would really help narrow down when the other issues may have been introduced.

Thanks,
-Max
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Patscherpofel » Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:17 am

I'm not sure about the jump thing. Does it jump right or left?

It felt like as soon as I exit the deadband it was doing an erractic correction on something
this was very noticable on right stick inputs ...but I didnt notice it on left
like the deadband wasnt centred to my stick somehow

I general I dont like that deadband
if I want smooth controls I use expo on my tx but not a high deadband...of course I dont want a jittery remote signal entering the controller...but the deadband used on AQ is much higher then it could be right?
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Patscherpofel » Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:03 pm

I guess the best would be to use this well working m4 with 1852 and update the fw
just to be sure...can I simply update and keep the parameters and mag/tare calibrations , or do I have to put in everything from scratch to make sure everything is correct?
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Max » Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:22 pm

You could go either way (update the well working one or downgrade the glitchy one)... whichever is easier. Did you say the glitchy one does/did work OK with older firmware also? Or did I make that up...

Either way your settings should be fine to carry over, and certainly calibration isn't affected. Save all current onboard settings to files before update just to have a copy in case you start changing things or something happens.

One possible gotcha to note when updating from 1852 would be

Due to new control configuration scheme, the Flight Mode and Home Set/RTH switch channels will be reset to defaults.


Rest of the changes from 1852 to "next" branch are summarized here: https://github.com/mpaperno/aq_flight_c ... CHANGES.md But the rest should all be backwards compatible with params from 1852.

Patscherpofel wrote:I general I dont like that deadband
if I want smooth controls I use expo on my tx but not a high deadband...of course I dont want a jittery remote signal entering the controller...but the deadband used on AQ is much higher then it could be right?


Right. Hence the new separate param for yaw deadband. ;) Any/all of the deadbands could be disabled on AQ and done purely in radio mix... even with different flight modes or whatnot.

-Max
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Patscherpofel » Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:30 pm

thanks Max, great help!

I never tried the 1923 on a bigger quad so far, had this m4 with that fw for a while on small race quad
so I dont really know...but I will update the one thats in there right now and compare it...especially the different pids I got
frome the change list I would guess that they should pretty much have the smme pids right?
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Max » Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:35 pm

None of the versions should have any difference as far as PID (or Quatos) settings. That would be a "highlighted" change for sure. That's why I'm concerned/surprised that you're seeing any difference with 1923. The only (intentional) change in regards to PIDs in 1923 was the addition of the separate rate-only mode settings.

-Max
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Re: Acro mode! And more...

Postby Patscherpofel » Sat Oct 29, 2016 10:27 am

so now I installed 1919 and it seams to fly fine...would need to test more to find out why 1952 was shaking so badly
could be the other m4 or some mistakes I did with the pid also

the problem with yaw is still in there, but I couldnt reproduce the yaw into the wrong direction
one thing is very clear that going in and out of the deadband is not smooth...and it somehow feels that it reacts different to left and right...maybe that is the problem with the code you found , I dont know

one question...did the1952 had deadband on yaw at all?
even a deadband of only 2 is very noticable...maybe there needs to be some sort of speed ramp between inside and outside of deadband?

did it have a default smoothing filter on 1952 (roll/pitch/ yaw angle and rate tau)? or is this something implemented recently to bypass the pid controller?
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